There was a TV commercial millions of years ago for Tootsie Pops, a hard candy sucker on a stick that had at its very center, a Tootsie Roll, which is a nasty, fake chololate thing that's more aptly suited as a chew-toy for a dog, and probably made out of that stuff you seal head-gaskets with. The commercial asked "How many licks does it take to get to the chewy center of a Tootsie Roll Tootsie Pop?"
I got an email today that reminded me of that old commercial, and I think you'll see why.
First, let me just say, that I get tons of letters, and that you are welcome to write to me anytime. I will do my best to answer and help you. I will never forward or republish your email to me, and it will always remain confidential. As a writer I do have some control over the confidentiality of my sources, so you don't have to worry that some asshole from the NSA is going to send the DEA over to get you because you wrote me about the OxyContin you gobbled down and now have questions about it. Lastly, I legally have to remind you that I am not a doctor, have no medical experience, and you should never ever take any action whatsoever based on what I say because I am an idiot. Doctors on the other hand are smarter than everybody in the whole world, and we know this is true because the government tells us so, and demonstrates this by giving exclusive licenses to them.
Now, all of that being said, I did receive an email today that I need to share with you. However, there's no way I would ever post the actual text of anyone's email, so I am going to paraphrase its content for you.
Somone wrote to me, we'll give her some really fancy original name like "Jane," and she wanted to know how long she has to keep doing OxyContin before she's going to feel the effects of withdrawal.
Uh, yep.
She managed to get her hands on a huge, family-sized bucket of 80s. She got them so cheap too! Back when I was using, if I'd stumbled across a deal like the one he scored, I'd be happer than if I'd won the lottery. Suffice it to say it was a huge quantity of OxyContin tablets and she acquired them for about ten cents on the dollar as compared to the typical street price. Oh, and no, they weren't those smarmy little 10 milligram scooby snacks either. She hit the motherlode. Got it?
She'd never used them before this acquisition. A virgin to opioids, she has been using them for about 75 days, but did not say by what method she is administering the OxyContin. She has noticed though, that after a nice smooth buzz for a couple of days, she's felt kind of icky when she decided it was time to get back to the real world. As a result, she decided she'd extend her run for a week or so, and now she feels oh so good!
She's now a little concerned. She has no street contact to get more when her 44 ounce sized Big Gulp Prescription runneth out. She asked me if she was likely to go through withdrawals when the well finally runs dry.
I don't mean to embarass her, and I am teasing her just a bit, but in the event that there are other people out in the world who are in the same situation, asking the same questions, I thought it would be beneificial for them in the event anyone comes across my extremely wordy and obscure blog.
Before I let you read my response, I just want to say this: if you are in the same situation as this young woman, please realize that you are in dangerous territory. If you have to wonder, have to ask, whether or not what you might have felt is the onset of withdrawal, then the question isn't "What will it be like when I finally stop?" Nope. The question is, "Why the hell don't I stop NOW?"
Go smoke a joint, drink a bottle of Belvedere, go to Disneyland, go get laid, go eat chocolate, go do whatever it is that gets you off, but stop taking the OxyContin. Stop now. Any vice that you have is better than the one you are exposing yourself to. And, let me state that 'vice' is a really stupid word, because it says something about those activities being somehow morally wrong, and in my mind, they aren't. In my mind, there's nothing morally wrong about using OxyContin either. What's 'wrong' with OxyContin is twofold. First, if you get hooked, you are cooked. It's a living hell. Secondly, even if you get past the hooked part without OD'ing, without going broke, without dying, without losing your sanity, friends, and everything else that matters to you......even if you survive all that, I promise you this:
You might never, ever again, find so much pleasure in anything else on this planet.
Jack Nicholson made a movie years ago, in which there's a scene I will never forget. He plays a character who has a lot of psychological/emotional problems. He's in the packed waiting room of a psychotherapists office, and it's a foregone conclusion of course, that all those people are there because life just aint' giving them what they want. As he looks over the sad crowd before exiting the room, he glares, and loudly addresses the whole room with the following question:
"What if this is as good as it gets?" He turns, quietly shuts the door, and leaves.
Damn, that is cruel! OxyContin is cruel in exactly the same way. Forget the withdrawals, dependency, and everything else. If you survive, what if OxyContin is as good as it gets?
The real answer of course, is that life goes on. My shrink actually suggested that I might be correct to assume that I will never again find anything as alluring as OxyContin. He may be right, but that doesn't mean I should, or anyone else should, give up. Life will go on, but why put yourself through the hell that most of the people who write to me have gone through (myself included).
Oxy sucks. Oxy is wonderful.
Getting screwed over sucks. Revenge is fulfilling. Somehow we manage to avoid killing the bastards who have screwed us over and life goes on. Maybe it's the same with OxyContin.
So to answer Jane's questions...
Are you going to go through withdrawal syndrome after such a short duration? I think you probably will, but you might not. Nobody knows for sure. I can assure you of one thing though:
...You will find out.
Do you want to find out now, or later?
Stop taking the shit right now, Jane.
Peace,
Gus
Showing posts with label withdrawal. Show all posts
Showing posts with label withdrawal. Show all posts
Saturday, July 19, 2008
Friday, July 06, 2007
Getting Off Suboxone
I get a lot of emails from people who want to know what it is like to quit taking Suboxone. I've dedicated two long chapters to the topic in my book, but until it's published, here are some thoughts about what I learned and what it was like.
What follows is my reply to a recent email, the text of which follows:
-------------------------------------------------------
Dear Danny:
Here's some of what it was like for me to quit Suboxone.
1. The first time I tried to get off Suboxone, I failed. I tapered from 4mg for about a month, then 2mg for 10 days. I went through some serious withdrawals (Christmas Day 2006...a massacre). I went back to the doctor and we decided to stretch it out on 2 mg for a longer period.
Lesson: You might not make it the first time. You can always go back if you have to.
2. After the Christmas mess, I stayed on 2mg throughout February 2007. I would experiment with skipping days. It worked. When I got down to 2mg I would occasionally skip a day. It was o.k. I made it. I also chopped the 2mg tablets in half. I would try it for a day or so, and if I started feeling bad, I would take 2mg and then get on with trying the halves the next day.
Lesson: Keep trying to go lower. Give yourself room to go back up if you need it.
3. I watched my bottle of Suboxone halves begin to dwindle. I was amazed that a chunk of a pill smaller than a breadcrumb was necessary to keep me normal. However, at some point I realized I couldn't just keep taking breadcrumbs. On March 9th, 2007 I ran out.
Lesson: Eventually you're going to have to quit taking it. If you really want off, you got to prepare.
4. Amazingly, when I ran out, I felt fine for two and a half days. The withdrawals kicked in at 36 hours, but (and this is important) it wasn't nearly as bad as it had been when I tried to quit during Christmas when I was at 2mg. I felt really tired, weak, and had all the typical symptoms, however, it was nothing compared to a full-blown withdrawal from what you might experience with Oxy or heroin. I took Clonidine for the first three days and it helped. It made it easier to sleep and easier to get up. This took place on a weekend, so I tried to take it easy.
Lesson: It's not as bad as you might think. Clonidine helps. Take it easy.
5.After seven days, I still felt weak. The withdrawal from Suboxone is long and tedious, but it isn't so bad that I felt like I needed to go back on it again. Frankly, it took a couple of months before I really felt completely better, and to be sure, I think that there are still some after effects that I am experiencing four months later (occasional sleep disruption, occasional digestive issues, low energy).
Lesson: Be patient. You'll get better a little bit each day.
6. Now for the good part. When I was actively using and I'd try to quit Oxy, I'd go through withdrawals for maybe three or four days, and the whole time, all I could think about was that I wanted some damned Oxy. When I quit Suboxone, I didn't realize it at first, but one day it hit me: "Even though I don't feel 100% better, what's weird is that I don't crave Oxy." If you've taken Suboxone, you know that you don't get high on it, and the fact of the matter is not only that I didn't crave Oxy, I didn't crave Suboxone either.
Lesson: There's a reward at the end of all of this. Your craving probably won't be there.
Once I got off the Suboxone, the seriously weirdest part was that I didn't want to go out and get drugs. I hadn't taken any opiates the entire 18 months I was on Suboxone, so I was completely removed from that whole scene.
I'm feeling a lot better now, but there's still more for me to do. Most of it has to do with realizing that I am no longer hooked and that now I need to find things to do that make my life worthwhile. If you've used opiates, you know that when you are high, there isn't anything that can bother you. Unfortunately, it is those things that we're avoiding when were high that will still be there when we're not. Here's what I am searching for: finding the contentment I felt when I was high, without being high. Ultimately, I guess that is what humans have been searching for since the beginning of time.
For technical information on quitiing Suboxone, I suggest taking a look at this article that my physician gave me from the following journal:
"Burprenorphine:how to use it right."
Johnson RE, Strain EC, Amass L.
Journal: "Drug and Alcohol Dependence." 2003; 70:S59-S77.
Good luck tapering off Suboxone. Lastly, remember that I am not qualified to give anyone medical advice. I am not a physician and nothing that I write should be construed as medical advice. Anyone who is looking for medical advice should consult a medical doctor.
Your Bud,
Gus
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi gus
Im sure you get a lot of emails asking how you got off the suboxone. Im stuck and scared. I search all over the internet just to find horror story after horror story. Ive been on it about 14 mos now--4-6mg a day. Im having trouble tapering and i want to be off this now.
Danny
What follows is my reply to a recent email, the text of which follows:
-------------------------------------------------------
Dear Danny:
Here's some of what it was like for me to quit Suboxone.
1. The first time I tried to get off Suboxone, I failed. I tapered from 4mg for about a month, then 2mg for 10 days. I went through some serious withdrawals (Christmas Day 2006...a massacre). I went back to the doctor and we decided to stretch it out on 2 mg for a longer period.
Lesson: You might not make it the first time. You can always go back if you have to.
2. After the Christmas mess, I stayed on 2mg throughout February 2007. I would experiment with skipping days. It worked. When I got down to 2mg I would occasionally skip a day. It was o.k. I made it. I also chopped the 2mg tablets in half. I would try it for a day or so, and if I started feeling bad, I would take 2mg and then get on with trying the halves the next day.
Lesson: Keep trying to go lower. Give yourself room to go back up if you need it.
3. I watched my bottle of Suboxone halves begin to dwindle. I was amazed that a chunk of a pill smaller than a breadcrumb was necessary to keep me normal. However, at some point I realized I couldn't just keep taking breadcrumbs. On March 9th, 2007 I ran out.
Lesson: Eventually you're going to have to quit taking it. If you really want off, you got to prepare.
4. Amazingly, when I ran out, I felt fine for two and a half days. The withdrawals kicked in at 36 hours, but (and this is important) it wasn't nearly as bad as it had been when I tried to quit during Christmas when I was at 2mg. I felt really tired, weak, and had all the typical symptoms, however, it was nothing compared to a full-blown withdrawal from what you might experience with Oxy or heroin. I took Clonidine for the first three days and it helped. It made it easier to sleep and easier to get up. This took place on a weekend, so I tried to take it easy.
Lesson: It's not as bad as you might think. Clonidine helps. Take it easy.
5.After seven days, I still felt weak. The withdrawal from Suboxone is long and tedious, but it isn't so bad that I felt like I needed to go back on it again. Frankly, it took a couple of months before I really felt completely better, and to be sure, I think that there are still some after effects that I am experiencing four months later (occasional sleep disruption, occasional digestive issues, low energy).
Lesson: Be patient. You'll get better a little bit each day.
6. Now for the good part. When I was actively using and I'd try to quit Oxy, I'd go through withdrawals for maybe three or four days, and the whole time, all I could think about was that I wanted some damned Oxy. When I quit Suboxone, I didn't realize it at first, but one day it hit me: "Even though I don't feel 100% better, what's weird is that I don't crave Oxy." If you've taken Suboxone, you know that you don't get high on it, and the fact of the matter is not only that I didn't crave Oxy, I didn't crave Suboxone either.
Lesson: There's a reward at the end of all of this. Your craving probably won't be there.
Once I got off the Suboxone, the seriously weirdest part was that I didn't want to go out and get drugs. I hadn't taken any opiates the entire 18 months I was on Suboxone, so I was completely removed from that whole scene.
I'm feeling a lot better now, but there's still more for me to do. Most of it has to do with realizing that I am no longer hooked and that now I need to find things to do that make my life worthwhile. If you've used opiates, you know that when you are high, there isn't anything that can bother you. Unfortunately, it is those things that we're avoiding when were high that will still be there when we're not. Here's what I am searching for: finding the contentment I felt when I was high, without being high. Ultimately, I guess that is what humans have been searching for since the beginning of time.
For technical information on quitiing Suboxone, I suggest taking a look at this article that my physician gave me from the following journal:
"Burprenorphine:how to use it right."
Johnson RE, Strain EC, Amass L.
Journal: "Drug and Alcohol Dependence." 2003; 70:S59-S77.
Good luck tapering off Suboxone. Lastly, remember that I am not qualified to give anyone medical advice. I am not a physician and nothing that I write should be construed as medical advice. Anyone who is looking for medical advice should consult a medical doctor.
Your Bud,
Gus
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi gus
Im sure you get a lot of emails asking how you got off the suboxone. Im stuck and scared. I search all over the internet just to find horror story after horror story. Ive been on it about 14 mos now--4-6mg a day. Im having trouble tapering and i want to be off this now.
Danny
Monday, June 18, 2007
Suboxone Withdrawal: Licking the inside of a pill bottle
I had been off Suboxone for a week and a day. Feet like concrete blocks, dying for sleep, I wondered when it would end. Granted, withdrawal from Suboxone wasn't even as horrible as a full blown OxyContin detox, it was difficult nonetheless. On the 8th day, I reached into a recycle bin where I had saved several of those little brown prescription pill bottles that had once contained Suboxone, and I poked into each one with my finger, licking off a thin, barely visible coating of orange powder. The difference between withdrawal from Oxy and Suboxone is that Oxy is more debilitating, but you'll feel a little bit better each day. With Suboxone, you won't be lying in a pool of vomit shaking like a chihuahua, but you will feel tired, weak, and generally ill, but most of all you'll be left wondering, day after day, if it will ever get better.
It will.
There's one other really significant difference between withdrawal from the two drugs. When I was using Oxy, I can remember two serious withdrawal episodes, and although I did feel a little better after a few days, I was left with huge cravings. Each time I tried to get off Oxy, a few days later I would stumble and fall face first into a big powdery pile of OC. With Suboxone I felt lifeless for weeks on end, but I didn't feel the need to go get high. Not at all. The reason? My shrink says this: it's all about conditioning. After 18 months on Suboxone, my brain no longer connected the dots between Oxy and feeling bad (or good). Conditioning is, after all, what the whole program is all about.
It's not a whole hell of a lot different from Nicorette or Commit, the two nicotine substitutes for smokers. Take Commit instead of a smoke, you'll get the nicotine you need, and after a long enough period of time, your brain will forget to light up. Same thing with Suboxone.
I just wish it hadn't taken so long to feel better after quitting Suboxone. It's been 90 days. I am now feeling almost 100% back to normal. The upside? Methadone is a lot worse, or so they say. Best of all, I don't need no stinking Oxy. Game over.
What's next?
Love,
Gus
It will.
There's one other really significant difference between withdrawal from the two drugs. When I was using Oxy, I can remember two serious withdrawal episodes, and although I did feel a little better after a few days, I was left with huge cravings. Each time I tried to get off Oxy, a few days later I would stumble and fall face first into a big powdery pile of OC. With Suboxone I felt lifeless for weeks on end, but I didn't feel the need to go get high. Not at all. The reason? My shrink says this: it's all about conditioning. After 18 months on Suboxone, my brain no longer connected the dots between Oxy and feeling bad (or good). Conditioning is, after all, what the whole program is all about.
It's not a whole hell of a lot different from Nicorette or Commit, the two nicotine substitutes for smokers. Take Commit instead of a smoke, you'll get the nicotine you need, and after a long enough period of time, your brain will forget to light up. Same thing with Suboxone.
I just wish it hadn't taken so long to feel better after quitting Suboxone. It's been 90 days. I am now feeling almost 100% back to normal. The upside? Methadone is a lot worse, or so they say. Best of all, I don't need no stinking Oxy. Game over.
What's next?
Love,
Gus
Wednesday, April 11, 2007
28 Days Without Suboxone Makes One Weak
As of this morning it has been 28 days since my last dose of Suboxone and I am still not feeling completely better. I hesitate to tell anyone that I still feel like crap for fear that it will deter someone from proceeding with treatment. I feel tired, weak, slow, unmotivated. I went to my Shrink today and he sent me to the lab for a comprehensive blood test in an attempt to rule out some disease that popped up concurrently with my detox from the Subox. The tests came back today and for the most part, there is nothing wrong with me, therefore, my doctor and I can only assume that this is pretty much the typical course for withdrawal from Suboxone.
The literature claims that the withdrawal syndrome from Suboxone is "mild" compared to withdrawal from a full-agonist, and in my experience so far that's true, however, the length of time it takes to complete withdrawal is amazing. I've read that the length of the half-life and the total duration of use determines the length of the withdrawal syndrome. Suboxone has a half-life of about 36 hours, so it is a little shorter than Methadone, but let me tell you, I am shocked that I don't feel better yet.
I was down to 1 mg. per day when I quit. To put that into perspective, the manufacturer doesn't even make a 1 mg. tablet...I was cutting the 2 mg. tablets in half for about a month. When I quit, I was taking a daily dose of Suboxone the size of a breadcrumb. It amazes me that the lack of such a small substance could make me feel so bad.
It took about 8 or 9 days before I really started feeling better. That is, I was able to walk without getting too tired, I could sleep without taking Clonidine, and most of the symptoms had subsided. However, the tiredness remains after almost a month, and that is amazing.
I used Suboxone for 18 months. I started at 24 mg. per day and worked my way downward, continuously until the end. In retrospect, I wouldn't have changed a thing. I know that had I used Suboxone for a shorter amount of time, say only six months, I might have had a better experience coming off of it. However, I am completely certain, in my own mind, that had I not stayed on Suboxone as long as I did, it is very likely that I would not have been able to remain abstinent from the Oxy. I am feeling quite strong about staying away from the Oxy at this point. Of course, I've got the potential for a huge addiction to the stuff, so who can say what tomorrow will bring, however, right now I'm pretty sure I don't want to go through the hell I've been through all over again!
Saying goodbye to Suboxone was difficult; a lot more difficult than I ever thought it would be. On the other hand, it saved my life. It took me two serious attempts to get off of it, and I still feel like hell, but I hold out for hope for the future. During the first few days off of the stuff I would have these manic moments of intense happiness that were better than any 'high' I can remember, but those days went away after a week or so and then the hard part began. It is still difficult to keep going day after day and feeling physically unwell, but I believe that things can only get better.
I am finishing up the book about this whole experience. Now that I have finished the Suboxone, I guess I need to wrap it up. So, I've been doing a lot of research to support the informational part of the story. Hopefully the book will be done soon. It seems so timely....the death Anna Nicole Smith from prescription drugs, stars and starlets going to rehab because of opiate addiction, and just the other day, a US Congressman admitted his addiction to Oxy. Hopefully I'll be able to help a lot of not-so-famous people make decisions that will suit them.
Talk to ya later.....
Gus Montana....hehehehehehe
The literature claims that the withdrawal syndrome from Suboxone is "mild" compared to withdrawal from a full-agonist, and in my experience so far that's true, however, the length of time it takes to complete withdrawal is amazing. I've read that the length of the half-life and the total duration of use determines the length of the withdrawal syndrome. Suboxone has a half-life of about 36 hours, so it is a little shorter than Methadone, but let me tell you, I am shocked that I don't feel better yet.
I was down to 1 mg. per day when I quit. To put that into perspective, the manufacturer doesn't even make a 1 mg. tablet...I was cutting the 2 mg. tablets in half for about a month. When I quit, I was taking a daily dose of Suboxone the size of a breadcrumb. It amazes me that the lack of such a small substance could make me feel so bad.
It took about 8 or 9 days before I really started feeling better. That is, I was able to walk without getting too tired, I could sleep without taking Clonidine, and most of the symptoms had subsided. However, the tiredness remains after almost a month, and that is amazing.
I used Suboxone for 18 months. I started at 24 mg. per day and worked my way downward, continuously until the end. In retrospect, I wouldn't have changed a thing. I know that had I used Suboxone for a shorter amount of time, say only six months, I might have had a better experience coming off of it. However, I am completely certain, in my own mind, that had I not stayed on Suboxone as long as I did, it is very likely that I would not have been able to remain abstinent from the Oxy. I am feeling quite strong about staying away from the Oxy at this point. Of course, I've got the potential for a huge addiction to the stuff, so who can say what tomorrow will bring, however, right now I'm pretty sure I don't want to go through the hell I've been through all over again!
Saying goodbye to Suboxone was difficult; a lot more difficult than I ever thought it would be. On the other hand, it saved my life. It took me two serious attempts to get off of it, and I still feel like hell, but I hold out for hope for the future. During the first few days off of the stuff I would have these manic moments of intense happiness that were better than any 'high' I can remember, but those days went away after a week or so and then the hard part began. It is still difficult to keep going day after day and feeling physically unwell, but I believe that things can only get better.
I am finishing up the book about this whole experience. Now that I have finished the Suboxone, I guess I need to wrap it up. So, I've been doing a lot of research to support the informational part of the story. Hopefully the book will be done soon. It seems so timely....the death Anna Nicole Smith from prescription drugs, stars and starlets going to rehab because of opiate addiction, and just the other day, a US Congressman admitted his addiction to Oxy. Hopefully I'll be able to help a lot of not-so-famous people make decisions that will suit them.
Talk to ya later.....
Gus Montana....hehehehehehe
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